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Thursday, October 15, 2009

President Obama is Right...on This Issue

I realize that this video is a little old, but it's still causing quite a stir throughout the religious community:

Personally, I am STRONGLY opposed to the belief that America is/was a Christian Nation. I think it's obvious that the Founders (at least the majority of them) also felt this way. There are a plethora of quotations, sources, etc. from various founders who refuted the notion of a Christian Nation and advocated for a separation between church and state. Here are a few of my favorites:

"We have abundant reason to rejoice that in this land the light of truth and reason has triumphed over the power of bigotry and superstition and that every person may here worship God according to the dictates of his own heart. In this enlightened Age & in this Land of equal liberty it is our boast, that a man's religious tenets, will not forfeit his protection of the Laws, nor deprive him of the right of attaining & holding the highest offices that are known in the United States."
~George Washington, Letter to the Swedenborgians, 1793.

"The Government of the United States of America is not, in any sense, founded on the Christian religion."
~John Adams, Article XI of the Treaty of Tripoli, June 7, 1797.

the scriptures support, confirm, and corroborate, but do not supercede the operations of reason and the moral sense.
~James Wilson

"An incarnate God!!! An eternal, self-existent, omnipresent omniscient Author of this stupendous Universe, suffering on a Cross!!! My Soul starts with horror, at the Idea, and it has stupified the Christian World. It has been the Source of almost all of the Corruptions of Christianity.”
~John Adams to John Quincy Adams, March 28, 1816

Millions of innocent men, women and children, since the introduction of Christianity, have been burnt, tortured, fined and imprisoned; yet we have not advanced one inch towards uniformity.
~Thomas Jefferson, Notes on Virginia, 1782

Where the preamble declares, that coercion is a departure from the plan of the holy author of our religion, an amendment was proposed by inserting "Jesus Christ," so that it would read "A departure from the plan of Jesus Christ, the holy author of our religion;" the insertion was rejected by the great majority, in proof that they meant to comprehend, within the mantle of its protection, the Jew and the Gentile, the Christian and Mohammedan, the Hindoo and Infidel of every denomination.
~Thomas Jefferson, Autobiography, in reference to the Virginia Act for Religious Freedom

An alliance or coalition between Government and religion cannot be too carefully guarded against......Every new and successful example therefore of a perfect separation between ecclesiastical and civil matters is of importance........religion and government will exist in greater purity, without (rather) than with the aid of government.~James Madison to Edward Livingston, 1822
In the video above, President Barack Obama supports exactly what the founders intended. It's not that the founders (or President Obama) are anti-religious like so many Christians today claim. Rather, the understand that calling the United States a "Christian Nation" is akin to creating a false sense of religious favoritism.

President Obama also made some similar comments(actually even better comments) while campaigning:

On this one, Obama is 100% right. Why Christian conservatives can't seem to understand this basic and fundamentally important issue is beyond me.


Hangmann747 said...

Hello All,

I totally agree that we (the US) are not and never have been a Christian Nation. However, being a nation that was founded under principles that agreed with Christian one's are two different things.

Example: If you are a Christian you are going to make rules in your house, say to not allow TV after 8:00 pm, which is neither in the Bible but it also does not violate any of it's principles.

There are also plenty of examples of our Founding Fathers quoting Jesus and the Bible. Jefferson said on many occasions that although he was not a total Bible believer he did feel the morals of the Bible should be "lived by". John Adams said the Constitution was wholly inadequate for anyone but a moral and religious people.

See the Bible does talk of self-government, and does give examples of it vs. examples God did not want. Baron de La Brède et de Montesquieu’s ideas on a multi-branch government fit those biblical principles. If it had not, I feel the founders would have kept searching for a type of government that would have agreed with their convicted principles.

After all it was their convicted principles, IE: Declaration of Independence, that caused them to revolt against England in the first place.

"All men are endowed by their Creator with rights, Life , Liberty, and the pursuit of happiness...all men are Created Equal."

My Further thoughts on "God’s Constitution"...


As Always Thanks for being involved, Many Blessings, Shane

"Standing Strong" & "Closing Ranks"
and still in the "Hunt For Red November"

Brad Hart said...

Funny that Jefferson would suggest we live by the Bible when he himself made his OWN Bible.

Hangmann747 said...

Hey Brad,

Not live by the Bible, Live by it's morals. Which he included in his bible.


Brad Hart said...

I think Jefferson was more of a unitarian rationalist than a Christian.

Hangmann747 said...

Hey Brad,

Now I never said Jefferson was a Christian. If Fact I'm Not sure what he was or even if he called himself anything. However, unitarian rationalist does fit what I understand of him.

What I do know is that he did not believe in the divinity of Christ or the Miracles of the Bible. Among other things that was the major parts of the Bible he removed from his bible.